A VC - Latest Comments in Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

fredwilson — Tue, 24 Feb 2009 20:40:13 -0000

Open source software FTW

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

lilbyrdie — Mon, 23 Feb 2009 12:58:47 -0000

I got here late -- but, your photos really put emphasis on the point I've been trying to make: what's the difference between using Safari or Firefox and using Boxee?

Which begs the question... how can Hulu actually block a particular browser? That's basically what it's doing... Not the technical how, but with what right do they have to do that sort of blocking? Seems to me Boxee could easily enable playback in other ways to circumvent this... hopefully it doesn't have to resort to that. After all, in each case, Hulu is simply flash content to be played back in a flash browser. I can even use the flash browser on the PS3, which is designed for TV use...

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

john — Mon, 23 Feb 2009 12:17:24 -0000

I'm always amazed that you respond to most of the comments you receive. It is impressive.

Completely playing devils advocate. Sure, Boxee is software...so is Tivo (though they have an appliance they deliver it on top of). But when so-called partners block added experience, say like directv disabling the wireless functionality in the Tivo software, they can collapse the value of a product. You can always 'hack' these things but lets face the fact that most consumers just want the stinking functionality out the box. Buyers are consumers of features/functions. I'm not sure that I agree with your browser positioning, though I understand why you are going that route.

The extension concept of the product has always gotten an, oh man this could be cool, reaction from me. Looking forward to the additional extensions that get added into the product and I hope big media doesn't kill them before it happens.

BTW. I'm going to use the lifehacker hack. Guess who Hulu is going to go after next...

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

fredwilson — Sun, 22 Feb 2009 15:06:09 -0000

Thanks for the post and the link!

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

deancollins — Sun, 22 Feb 2009 14:27:25 -0000

more touchy feely dogooders than 'tech'.

learnt some interesting points about Android though.

http://deancollinsblog.blog...

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

fredwilson — Sun, 22 Feb 2009 14:23:11 -0000

You don't think walking in with a laptop and browsing through a wiki will
work? :)

How was barcamp mobile?

I ended up playing basketball with my son and his friends

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

deancollins — Sun, 22 Feb 2009 12:45:26 -0000

nice utilisation of crowd sourcing, obviously it needs to be reformatted to ppt before you pitch to a 'c'-suite audience though.

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

fredwilson — Sun, 22 Feb 2009 11:14:34 -0000

dean what do you think of boxee peer producing its pitch to content owners?

http://boxee.pbwiki.com/

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

fredwilson — Sun, 22 Feb 2009 08:49:11 -0000

We are going to try hard to insure it is not so

In the meantime, Lifehacker has some ideas for you

http://lifehacker.com/51576...

Remember that Boxee is software and like Firefox, it's a browser that has an
extension architecture

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

fredwilson — Sun, 22 Feb 2009 08:28:14 -0000

I don't see a link anywhere

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

john — Sat, 21 Feb 2009 18:41:59 -0000

Here is the real problem for Boxee. I have Boxee Alpha on my AppleTV and have been a frequent user. Boxee with Hulu great...Boxee without Hulu...I don't think I'll use it again.

Unfortunately Hulu's move feels much like my experience with Tivo and DirecTV. I LOVED Tivo. Resisted going to the DirecTV DVR. Complained to DirecTV about their strong-arm'ing of Tivo. Spent a bunch of money to keep and upgrade my Tivo(s) but finally, just this year, gave up and moved over to DirecTV HDDVRs. I absolutely hate them. It has ruined my viewing experience, the interface stinks, I watch less of the shows that I used to conveniently get through Tivo.

My gut tells me that Hulu is Tivo'ing Boxee. Best of luck to those boys but I think they need to start looking over their shoulder. Something is coming.

Signed...a disappointed Boxee'r.

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

Dwight — Sat, 21 Feb 2009 14:51:15 -0000

Fred,
I have been reading your blog since about 2004 ...great posts & insights
...been trying to get my friends at Calculated Risk <http: www.calculatedriskblog.com=""/> & Naked
Capitalism <http: www.nakedcapitalism.com=""/> to adopt Twitter at least to
the extent of using Twitterfeed <http: twitterfeed.com=""/> but its been a tough sell so
far read this post<http: www.nakedcapitalism.com="" 2009="" 02="" twitter-communication-and-my.html="">by Yves Smith to see what I am up against! I even asked Jack,
Ev<https: twitter.com="" empressario="" status="" 1174713303=""> , and Biz to comment on her blog but didn't see any comments from them yet. Any input to her would be great! Thanks
again for your reply. Here's are my notes on --- What is
Twitter<http: docs.google.com="" doc?id="dcvrgm3v_202crxgcndx">?

Dwight
Meltdown 2008 <http: meltdown2008.blogspot.com=""/>

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

fredwilson — Sat, 21 Feb 2009 12:50:15 -0000

Thanks. I'll try to stop by. Not sure I can

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

Morgan Warstler — Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:54:52 -0000

Couple of points...

Technical: The webkit browser (safari) allows easily for a script to go directly to Full Screen from Play. It also allows cloaking such that there'd be no way to know what browser you are even using.

Hulu side: I think everyone should first admit how much they'd care about Hulu if the number of ads increase 2x 3x... because at any level of scale, thats coming.

Ad supported content: Ultimately the best way of reducing the the number of ads you need to see to "pay" for content, is to expose as much personal data about yourself as possible. This rule is manifesting itself as we speak... here's your basic math: 16 ads per half hour * .015 cents = 24 cents. Expose enough data, and some people will watch that show with only 1 ad.

Cable side: Cable is a great deal. All in total communication (triple play) still costs less than it costs to heat your home, lease your car, (and for many people) drink your Starbucks.

Nice comment on the low cost device Fred ;)

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

curmudgeonly troll — Sat, 21 Feb 2009 11:34:33 -0000

seemed hard to enforce if you're still distributing to any browser, and sure enough

Lifehacker - http://lifehacker.com/51576...

might seem like Hulu, after coming from nowhere to get tremendous traction v. YouTube , gets hamstrung by the content provider who prefers extending analog revenue stream by a few months v. owning a stake in the digital future.

or alternatively, content providers cleverly throw a sop to cable companies, knowing it won't matter anyway.

either way, will make a hell of a case study

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

deancollins — Sat, 21 Feb 2009 10:57:24 -0000

Hunter College, 68th st.

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

fredwilson — Sat, 21 Feb 2009 09:37:07 -0000

Where is it?

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

deancollins — Sat, 21 Feb 2009 09:25:14 -0000

i prefer UFC during my personal time off as well.

When it comes to business and my work hours i prefer chess and strategy.

But hey you are richer out of the two of us so wtf do I really know.

I think this discussion has reached an impass - I'm off to barcamp mobile for the rest of the day in case you are going to be there as well.

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

fredwilson — Sat, 21 Feb 2009 09:21:09 -0000

I've never enjoyed chess. I prefer WWE smackdown!

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

deancollins — Sat, 21 Feb 2009 09:13:41 -0000

ugh doesn't anyone on the union square or boxee team play chess??

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

fredwilson — Sat, 21 Feb 2009 09:07:08 -0000

Maybe the post on lifehacker on a boxee extension (boxee is like Firefox in that you can create extenstions) that gets Hulu back on Boxee might work better than my argument

http://lifehacker.com/51565...

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

deancollins — Sat, 21 Feb 2009 08:38:59 -0000

I think our bet still has 5 months to run?

Having said that I was more confident until Neomedia had their USPTO case upheld on the 17th of feb.

Am also very dissapointed in the EFF as from this statement it looks like they are giving up their challenge
http://www.eff.org/deeplink...

So yes in 5 months from now i think you are going to win.

Cheers,
Dean
BTW the point i was making to Fred wasn't a bet. It was more a suggestion that the way they are handling this issue with Boxee is wrong and that they need to reframe the issue in a different way in order to convince Hulu that they want to be on the Boxee network.
It's a basic fundamental flaw in the way they have set up their case at the moment that is causing them these issues.

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

Slavin — Sat, 21 Feb 2009 01:39:50 -0000

>>Save this web page and put the url into your diary to re-read one year from now. I think you might read it in a different light (lol i'll be waiting for your call at that time).

I'm still waiting to get my money from the last bet you made with the same certainty...

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

Rich Ziade — Fri, 20 Feb 2009 17:16:48 -0000

Isn't this sort of about controlling delivery - which while a dying concept - is still worth pursuing if you've got content streaming through your services?

Re: Why Hulu Should Embrace Boxee

Marsh Gardiner — Fri, 20 Feb 2009 15:13:24 -0000

Some excellent comments here already. I wanted to write yesterday, but was offline all day, so here's my late-to-the-party contribution.

1. I'm sure you'll agree we're already in the "attention era". And surprise, it's competitive. TV's long-dominance is threatened by competitors like videogames/YouTube/the internet in general. The "content providers'" (aka Big Media's) competitive advantage is in creating compelling content. Hulu is a distribution channel, and putting up ANY barriers to consumption weakens their ability to compete. The content providers have hobbled their own horse. (Sidebar: is it misleading to describe Fox and NBC as "content providers" as they are networks too?)

2. To me, Boxee served two important roles w/r/t Hulu. First it was a "skin" for the 10 foot experience. Second, it promised a centralized future in which content providers (Hulu, YouTube, Netflix, etc) are aggregated into a unified interface. BUT... if Hulu really "wanted" this, they would have provided an API that would encourage innovation while retaining some control over how "their" content could be repurposed (possibly requiring data in return). While I applaud their website offering, they really should have dealt with the API issues, creating a platform for delivering their "channels".

3. DVRs are a threat to content providers. Hulu's ads are much shorter than a typical broadcast—perhaps a concession to the points in #1 above? One important difference is that Hulu controls the stream, so unless you cache it (wrap their player?), it's hard to skip commercials. Maybe this means nothing, as in time this probably gets circumvented, but at least in the short run it turns the DVR tide slightly (i.e. Boxee people would watch more commercials than Tivo people). Furthermore, consumers can keep Tivo episodes as long as they want (ignoring broadcast flag issues), whereas Hulu viewers can't.

4. I was most struck by the Disney quote on the Hulu blog announcement. Has there been any company more fixated on controlling its content than Disney? Big Media must embrace change or suffer through the throes that the recording industry finds itself in.